Asking for advice on a 95 year old using a power chair

[cpetku]

So my mom (95) had a fall a couple of months ago resulting in hospitalization and rehab. Independence with a walker is not an option at this time as she lost too much strength. I use a manual WC for appointments (won't fit into the bathroom) and could consider her stepping through the house in a transfer chair, but she doesn't lock the wheels when moving from a WC to her bed or the toilet. A power WC has an automatic brake which seems safer.

I've tried preparing my house for mobility with an older mid-drive chair (Quantum J6) and fresh batteries. I know these aren't in vogue here, but I needed a tight turning radius and smaller width for accessing the bathroom. While I think mom will be able to adapt to the chair with time, there are a few issues I could use advice on...

#1 She is blind in the left eye from a stroke and color blind in the right eye with cataracts. While a surgeon could address the cataract, she doesn't want to risk it and I understand. However she can't see the power button and has trouble with reading the display. I tried putting a cabinet bumper on the power button for tactile identification but it won't stay stuck. Any advice on something that worked for you? This is the biggest issue since she gets into the chair from bed then is stuck trying to understand why it won't move.

#2 I don't like the way the chair turns (too fast even at lowest speed). I have a CAN adapter arriving next week with hopes of adjusting drive parameters. I have all the necessary software in place, so I assume I just follow the directions in the sticky's. This should arrive in about four days, my plan is to eventually connect it using a 6pin molex connector using a can multiplier, but for now loose fitting pins in the armrest is the path. Would anyone recommend against changing the acceleration's based upon her age and mild dementia.

#3 I'm concerned about her pinching her hand in doorways, so I have ordered a swing-away mount (left and right) and necessary hardware for this chair. These parts should arrive in four or five days. For now I'm watching her like a hawk when I hear the joists in the house squeak (indicating a heavy chair is on the move). I'm hoping if her hand gets pinched, it will force the controller to the left and avoid her getting hurt. Is this adequate or too big of a risk (alternative is assisted living)?

#4 I've bought an attendant joystick and mounted it rearward so I can access it if she gets stuck with the main control inaccessible or if I choose to take control away from her. I did a quick test to make sure it's functional by using the connector for the main joystick (main joystick was unplugged). It worked but had flashing lights which I hope to diagnose once the CAN adapter comes in. Long term I will use a multiplier to ensure all peripherals are always connected to the CAN bus. Any Advice on problems I might run into with attendant controls?

I'm trying to keep her out of a long term care facility. Her options are limited due to being on home (peritoneal) dialysis. The rehab center I used for the last four weeks did the Dialysis, but didn't do a great job and caused an infection at the catheter exit site. They missed several exchanges as well and sent her back to the hospital for a eight hour eval when she started having involuntary arm movements. Most group home LTCF's have no experience with Peritoneal Dialysis patients and would require training. While I prefer the smaller environment of a group home, I'm not sure they are adequately staffed to allow their use even though I have a couple who have agreed they would consider her as a patient. After three experiences with rehab facilities claiming capability, I'm not sure any LTCF can meet the level of care I have provided for over four years, but if I can't make a powered wheelchair work then I may soon be out of options.

[Burgerman]

#1 She is blind in the left eye from a stroke and color blind in the right eye with cataracts. While a surgeon could address the cataract, she doesn't want to risk it and I understand. However she can't see the power button and has trouble with reading the display. I tried putting a cabinet bumper on the power button for tactile identification but it won't stay stuck. Any advice on something that worked for you? This is the biggest issue since she gets into the chair from bed then is stuck trying to understand why it won't move.

I have zero knowledge of that curtiss control system. So if it had been me, doing the choosing I would have bought a chair with R-Net and a real programmer. Because I have doubts that your can buss thingy and various connectors/software will all talk to each other and I dont understand most f its programming parameters. Where R-Net systems are very familiar and plug and play to me. In an suitable R-net joystick there are two 1/8th sterio jack connectors. One option in programming for these is to turn on or off the chair So you can fit any kind of switch you want! In any place that is easier for her to find. A huge red button some place with a loud beep for e.g.

#2 I don't like the way the chair turns (too fast even at lowest speed). I have a CAN adapter arriving next week with hopes of adjusting drive parameters. I have all the necessary software in place, so I assume I just follow the directions in the sticky's. This should arrive in about four days, my plan is to eventually connect it using a 6pin molex connector using a can multiplier, but for now loose fitting pins in the armrest is the path. Would anyone recommend against changing the acceleration's based upon her age and mild dementia.

Good luck with that can thing and the programming software.
Now, what do you mean by acceleration?
There is TURN acceleration and turn DECELERATION and in order to make a chair turn when you tell it, rather than gradually starting to speed up its turn over time, then this should be set to above 80 and not less. Turn DECELERATION should be set to probably 100, so that when you tell the chair to stop turning it does so. Setting this less means that it keeps on turniing long after you tried to stop it. The natural response it to push the stick the opposite way to try and stop the turning. Which then causes it to turn the opposite way for what fels like forever that you also cant stop... You end up with driver induced occilation caused by the delay in the system. If it turns TOO FAST reduce the MINIMUM TURN SPEED and the TURN SPEED not the turn acceleration to very low rates. Or were you refering to reverse accel, forward accell, reverse decel, forward decel and all the minimum ones too? Or at all?

#3 I'm concerned about her pinching her hand in doorways, so I have ordered a swing-away mount (left and right) and necessary hardware for this chair. These parts should arrive in four or five days. For now I'm watching her like a hawk when I hear the joists in the house squeak (indicating a heavy chair is on the move). I'm hoping if her hand gets pinched, it will force the controller to the left and avoid her getting hurt. Is this adequate or too big of a risk (alternative is assisted living)?

Only you can tell. Fit a metal protector. But with turn acceleration set high, turn decellerations set high too, and turn speeds set to geological then she shouldnt be hitting door frames. Even with 1 good eye.

#4 I've bought an attendant joystick and mounted it rearward so I can access it if she gets stuck with the main control inaccessible or if I choose to take control away from her. I did a quick test to make sure it's functional by using the connector for the main joystick (main joystick was unplugged). It worked but had flashing lights which I hope to diagnose once the CAN adapter comes in. Long term I will use a multiplier to ensure all peripherals are always connected to the CAN bus. Any Advice on problems I might run into with attendant controls?

You shouldnt run into any.
At least in r-net you can set various ways to determine which one gets priority.

[cpetku]

Thank you,

For the first item (power button) I'm now trying a partial ECG (heart monitor) pad as that is a lot stickier and the electrode attachment serves as a tactile point so she doesn't have to be able to see it.

I'm concerned that I planned all of this based upon my abilities to think, see and manuver. I tried estimating her abilities by keeping my left eye shut. Unfortunately her eyesight is far worse than I was led to believe or has gotten a significantly worse in the last two months. She's catching wheels on walls (corners) and not understanding that's why the chair is stopping.

For the wiring aspect, I'm an electrical engineer, so CAN interconnections aren't a big issue. The only concern there is if there is custom Pride software that will get in the way. The more I research I do, it becomes quite evident that this is a closed system where they want dealers to make profits and not simply enable customers. Something as simple as accessories seem to be hidden away in non-public documentation, so I understand your recommending other brands.

I understand that I may have to experiment unless someone has had a very bad outcome in a similar situation in which case I need to understand if I'm making a mistake. I can go to a small transfer chair where the risk is she doesn't lock the wheels while I'm outside or at the office and has another fall (but from a seated height).

[biscuit]

This is what i use for tactile guides:
https://amzn.eu/d/05MQMHGi

They are little plastic rhinestones assorted shapes, cost a fiver or so for half a dozen sheets. I use them everywhere espcially on wheelchair on off switches. My one eye is mostly blind.

I have a wheelchair in my very unadapted house, i went for the shortest wheelbase I could find which seemed to be the Roma Vienna. The width was less problem in tight spaces than the length.

[biscuit]

And this would be my actual rhinestone selection: https://amzn.eu/d/0fFGGq6r
The flower shaped ones for on of switches as fingers find them easy to press. The oblongs strategically positioned on the profiling bed controller to raise and lower in the dark. Not the stars or pearls, they are hard to press.

[cpetku]

I haven't been able to find an attendant joystick mount, so I decided to design a simple unit for the one I bought off of ebay with a clamp bracket (https://ebay.us/m/3KRjfe). STL file included in a zip file. I used ASA-CF and 12 wall loops to make this solid. Simply remove the captain chair headrest, slide this on and re-install. I intentionally made it a tight fit.

[cpetku]

Probably not all that useful nowadays, but here's an STL for making a 5 pin programming connector using the DIN housing included with the original Quantum J6 Charger (I had to replace mine). This may work for other din housings as well or a simple tweak using your favorite cad tool and this as a template. Print using your favorite filament (my standard is ASA-CF). Re-use pins from the original connector if you need a power and ground connection (e.g., handheld programmer). The two small pins appear to be 1.5mm diameter so I used #16 Deutsch pins that I had on hand. Pins should press fit into the printed part, but a little heat from a Soldering Iron to ensure setting of the pins may help. Solder in your programmer harness and doublecheck your ground/battery polarity if using that circuit. Re-assemble connector.

[cpetku]

This is what i use for tactile guides:
https://amzn.eu/d/05MQMHGi

They are little plastic rhinestones assorted shapes, cost a fiver or so for half a dozen sheets. I use them everywhere espcially on wheelchair on off switches. My one eye is mostly blind.

I have a wheelchair in my very unadapted house, i went for the shortest wheelbase I could find which seemed to be the Roma Vienna. The width was less problem in tight spaces than the length.

Thanks Biscuit. The ECG probe pad is working well for now since it's extra sticky and mom can understand its use. Now the trick is to keep her fingers off all the other buttons so she only runs the chair at slow speed (my poor walls)...

[Burgerman]

This all sounds like it will end with more care, someone else in charge.

[biscuit]

This all sounds like it will end with more care, someone else in charge.

Well at that age I suppose it's best to have help/care from somebody. I'm not that old, grumpier than most, and very prepared to bust a gut retaining and re-learning abilities I used to have in order to be independent and not have carers. I spent a few weeks in a respite care home when my mother died last year, the council then sent me carers for a while, but I sent them away when I realized that I would rather do everything myself although it is terribly slow and inefficient. Those carers were absolute darlings, with a packed schedule of visits to do before and after me and they would drop in right when I wanted to go out. But I don't have a static condition, I have a progressive disease that I'm getting lucky about at the moment and making the most of it.

I only have equipment I can manage alone, I have some remaining abilities and now that I only have my weekly cleaner I do bear a risk living on my own, plenty of faceplants and dragging myself around on the floor, all day to mess around getting dressed and making brekkie, and shedloads of rah-rah-rah encouragement from my rather surprised friends and family.

Certainly a recipe for carers one day, that's life. But not at the moment.

Wheelchairs inevitably damage walls, doors and door jambs.

Sorry cpetku, highjacking your technical topic for my crazy DIY philosophy.

[cpetku]

No issue Bicuit, I'm learning through the experience of others as I'm new to the idea of mom using an electric wheelchair in house. My halls and doorways were not designed with wheelchair access in mind and up until two months ago this wasn't an issue since she still had the strength to use a walker. As I indicated previously, I had to downsize the vanity in her bathroom to a bare minimum footprint to allow a mid-drive chair to turn around somewhat safely. I'm debating on modifying changing out the toilet assist handles since she tends to run over the bases (pipe). Can't use seat assist handles since I had to go to a bidet seat to solve other problems.

I had thought about trying to save the walls, mouldings, other fixtures and prevent the chair from jumping over the toilet assist fixture above (thus getting trapped) by reducing the torque settings on indoor profiles. However, after reading posts on Torque this seems like it could have unintended consequences.

Neither she nor I want to have to hire a full time caregiver to sit around the house and watch her all day. Hoping to keep her somewhat independent with the e-chair as long as her mental capacity to operate it holds up.

[Burgerman]

There is only so much you can do. But house damage will depend greatly on programming, eyesight, hand eye coordination, joystick position, and of course skills/practice. But at that age, partly blind and typica hovercrft steering I imagine it lke a war zone..

I can count on one hand the number of wall/door scrapes in my 30 years of driving a chair like I stole it. ONCE I figured out programming etc.

Theres literally non. In the last years. Not any black marks, nothing at all. So it can be OK.

And I dont slow own much even at 65.

[emilevirus]

But have you considered a lightweight powerchair? Lightweight means she basically can't damage anything unless she hits a wall full speed. I own one of those and even if I hit a wall it doesn't do much. If you hit a wall with a rehab chair, you're most certainly damaging it even at low speeds.

[cpetku]

Her full size chair which I use to take her to appointments just doesn't fit through the doors of any bathroom at my house, it's a loaner from the local senior center. I was warned that the rehab center couldn't commit to getting her independent with a walker again. Her nephrologist suggested I remodel my house to solve the issue but that means tearing out walls and putting a shower in where the garage entry doorway is. That just doesn't seem practical since it would later have to be removed. So, I started my search looking at lightweight foldable powerchairs while she was in rehab. The light weight chairs I looked at were rear drive and required significant turning radius which meant I would still have to remodel and tear out part of a wall. This is what drive me to mid-drive. Being frugal I looked at the specs for all of the used chairs for sale in my area. Maybe I should have involved a sales person for the new market, but newly retired, I'm frugal. For now I'm simply seeing if we can make this work with what I already bought. If not, it will drive selection of a new (low performance, tight turn radius) chair or other living arrangements. Based upon her current health, the benefit from remodeling would be short lived and most likely has to be reversed in the long term (doesn't add value to properties).

[biscuit]

Well I got a Pepe commode for about £75 from Amazon to avoid the lavatory

cubicle in my home, even the little Vienna with its short wheelbase couldn't go in that tiny room easily.

[cpetku]

Biscuit, It's one thing to manage your own needs and a totally different scenario when it burdens another, especially your child. Taking care of my mom has damaged my relationships with others and lead to depression as well as other mental health issues. Unfortunately, if I can't maintain her independence via access to the bathroom using a wheelchair, I will have to look for alternate living arrangements for her. That said I do have a BSC stored in a closet if it becomes the only option. Friends have been recommending I prioritize my own health for over two years, but there aren't many LTCF options for those on Periotoneal Dialysis. Taking care of her may be my own downfall as I've put off Knee (partial replacement) and Ankle (rebuild "obliterated" peroneal tendons) surgery for two years now. Eventually, the e-chair may be part of my recovery program...

[cpetku]

What I didn't make clear is due to the hose lengths on the dialysis machine, mom's bed is in the dining room, the machine is in the kitchen and the drain line just reaches the bathroom. Since there is an open wall between the dining room and living room, she can watch her shows on a large screen TV, but doesn't have access to the living room due to it being a step down setup. She lost the ability to do stairs two years ago. Around 40 boxes of supplies form a half wall between the two rooms. Been this way for almost five years.

[cpetku]

Mom managed to push the mode buttons and set the drive profile to #3 (I intend for her to only use #1 in house). She pinned her leg between the chair and wall apparently while turning and couldn't figure out how to solve this since she was in a lot of pain and will probably have a bad bruise. All I can think of is to program her four drive settings to low speed values so if she pushes the mode button it will have no effect. I really need to slow the turn rate down as even with a limit switch activated to run the chair at half of the lowest speed, turning is just too fast. I should be able to set the attendant control to a higher speed for my use in moving the chair around the house but the Curtis documentation implies I only get one drive profile setting for the attendant control. Maybe a newer Q-Logic control with a knob for speed control is an option. The CAN adapter is in Arlington IL waiting on the last mile delivery service to bring it over to Michigan. Maybe I'll have it on Wednesday and can avoid this happening again. If I can't solve this then the chair will get retired before it had much of a chance to help her. I can't risk her being pinned for an extended period while I'm working outside in the yard or at the office.

[cpetku]

I had some spare time so I created a two piece cup-holder for the J6. While functional, it is not intended for someone to put their body weight on and thus of limited use for those with cognitive decline. I realized this limitation while installing it and will not make it a permanent fixture on mom's chair. I'm leaving the allen screw loose to allow quick install/removal.

[Burgerman]

Mom managed to push the mode buttons and set the drive profile to #3 (I intend for her to only use #1 in house). She pinned her leg between the chair and wall apparently while turning and couldn't figure out how to solve this since she was in a lot of pain and will probably have a bad bruise. All I can think of is to program her four drive settings to low speed values so if she pushes the mode button it will have no effect. I really need to slow the turn rate down as even with a limit switch activated to run the chair at half of the lowest speed, turning is just too fast. I should be able to set the attendant control to a higher speed for my use in moving the chair around the house but the Curtis documentation implies I only get one drive profile setting for the attendant control. Maybe a newer Q-Logic control with a knob for speed control is an option. The CAN adapter is in Arlington IL waiting on the last mile delivery service to bring it over to Michigan. Maybe I'll have it on Wednesday and can avoid this happening again. If I can't solve this then the chair will get retired before it had much of a chance to help her. I can't risk her being pinned for an extended period while I'm working outside in the yard or at the office.

Just program only 1 drive profile. In a way that is super accurate and linear. And SLOW to do anything inc turning. And no others. You dont need have any more than 1 profile. And you dont have to have any speeds that are any different to the slow one either.

But there comes a point where you are fighting an impossible or impractical battle. Things may be at a point where this stuff wont work for her.

I really need to slow the turn rate down as even with a limit switch activated to run the chair at half of the lowest speed, turning is just too fast. I should be able to set the attendant control to a higher speed for my use in moving the chair around the house but the Curtis documentation implies I only get one drive profile setting for the attendant control. Maybe a newer Q-Logic control with a knob for speed control is an option.

There are 6 turn speed settngs. Which ones are you talking about?

--Set the turn acceleration, and minimum turn accelertion, both to 50 to 100. NOT less. (Less = unpredictable and difficult steering for everyone!) That DOES NOT control the turn speed.

--Set the minimum turn deceleration, and turn deceleration, both to 100. So that it stops turning WHEN you tell it. Or it will trap legs, miss door openings break fingers etc. This also does not control the turn speed!

--Set minimum turn speed to 1
--Set turn speed to 1.
These DO control turn speed. 1 will be too slow, and you will need to increase it...

Set minimum forward acceleration to any figure you decide is correct.
Set forward acceleration to the same figure.
Do the same for reverse acc and decel figures.

Set minimum forward speed to whatever you think is safe.
Set forward speed to the SAME as minimum forward speed.
Set minimum reverse speed to whatever you wish too.
Set reverse speed to the same figure.

DISABLE all other profiles once you tested this. Except the attendant one. Set that one to your choosen figures. You will then only have 2 profiles.

IF you cannot set any of these figures above its because they are locked behind walls.
Go to OEM Factory, set ABS settings to the max and minimum (100 or 0) across the board. Set minimum torque to 25% as you cannot set it lower. Before attempting to set all of the above.

Qlogic is crap, unprogramable, and you dont need one. Set as described above she will have only 1 profile. And 1 very slow CONTROLLABLE LINEAR ACCURATE speed. No matter what she presses.

[Burgerman]

I forgot you are using a non r-net programmer. So the above will STILL be correct but all the options may have different descriptions...

[cpetku]

Thank you for the recommendations and you may be right that this will eventually be a loosing battle due to her her vision impairment and cognitive decline.

Her leg is very sore today but she managed to transfer from bed to the chair to the toilet and back.

Another grab bar arriving today along with the rest of the parts for the swing-away joystick (to avoid crushed fingers) as well as a cable for connecting the attendant joystick (save my toes). The CAN adapter shipped out of China quickly but has been held up at the "last mile" delivery service since Friday, hoping it will make progress and be here tomorrow to limit her drive speed to a crawl since she put it in it's high speed profile by accident again this morning.

Hopefully my next post will simply be on the programming thread stating the CAN adapter arrived and worked.

[cpetku]

Posting updated cup holder after the first one failed due to mom using it for support. This bracket attaches to a common FRMASMB10617 joystick mount using M3 x12mm cap screws and nuts to provide a steel support. The re-used bracket is the steel tube type containing a four hole mount plate with 30mm on center pattern.

[cpetku]

And the updated cup holder